Legacy Burdens Cross-Cultural Healing With Ifs & Embrace Your Unicorn Self With Deran Young — EP60

Candice Wu 0:00
In this episode's special guest, Deran Young, shares her personal story about discovering internal family systems work, how she uses that work to claim and heal unseen parts of herself, as well as racial trauma and the legacy burden in the black community, how to have safe conversations around race and trauma, as well as Deran's experiences of being Muslim for five years, and being in the Air Force for 17. And her fascination with unicorns and believing in the magical.

Candice Wu 0:33
Hello and welcome. You're listening to the Embody Podcast, a show about remembering and embodying your true nature, inner wisdom, embodied healing, and self-love.

Candice Wu 0:47
My name is Candice Wu and I'm a holistic healing facilitator, intuitive coach, and artist sharing my personal journey of vulnerability, offering meditations and guided healing support, and having Co-Creative Conversations with healers and wellness practitioners from all over the world.

Candice Wu 1:08
So, before we jump into the episode, today, I want to share that there's a new class on Dream Work in Skillshare that I created. This is a class on how to prepare your body and your physiology, to be able to best remember your dreams, in order to remember our dreams and to be able to cultivate the wisdom and the meanings of our dreams, the questions that open up for us to live out different parts of ourselves and bring in empowerment and wisdom. We need to be able to feel safe in our bodies, and the ability to explore with curiosity and playfulness, as well as to be able to daydream. So this class is part one of two that explore and guide you through practices that help you to create a safer embodied life, as well as better sleep. And, therefore, being able to better remember your dreams.

Candice Wu 2:08
You can find the class on Skillshare, which is a paid membership. You can find this class about creating the blueprints of your physiology for a dream life to flourish at CandiceWu.com/dreamphysiology. You can also find the first class that I have about the one on one basics around remembering your dreams and how to record and harvest them at CandiceWu.com/dreamclass1. If you go to either of these links, you can join Skillshare and have two months free or their latest promotion of a premium membership, which is usually a couple of months free or the first couple of months for 99 cents, and thereafter. It's usually about $10 a month, and you can also access plenty of other classes by other teachers, teachers that are offering creative classes, inspirational classes, as well as informative ones.

Candice Wu 3:07
So I'd love for you to join me there and feel free to share with me any topics that you'd like to learn more about in a more in-depth of way. And in particular, this class is going to give you specific breathing techniques, yogic and body-centered practices and meditations that you can use to ground yourself, develop that safety and playfulness in your body, and for your dreams to thrive. So, all of these will support your nervous system and feeling a level of deep rest and relaxation and give your body the capacity to remember your dreams better than before. Again, that class is at CandiceWu.com/dreamphysiology.

Candice Wu 3:51
So, let's jump in today. It's great to have you back here and I hope you enjoy this really fun conversation that I had with Deran Young. She is fantastic and offers very good insight about how to bring more learning and understanding across culture and across racial difference as well as other difference. Deran Young is a licensed clinical social worker and the founder of Black Therapists Rock, which is a non-profit organization geared towards increasing awareness of social and emotional challenges that impact marginalized populations. And she previously served in the US Air Force for 17 years. She's an internationally experienced clinician, who's practiced in over five countries and most recently supported a week-long Internal Family Systems Training in China in October 2018. She's also been featured in the Huffington Post is one of 10 black female therapists you should know and I think this conversation will show you exactly why that is the case. She's a complete advocate for everyone's growth and learning. And that piece across all different types of people and that connection that bonds us spiritually.

Candice Wu 5:11
And if you're here for unicorns and unicorns, only because that's what inspired you to listen to the episode. Tune in because I love how Deran shares her fascination with unicorns and unburying her unicorn self. So, without further ado, I want to introduce to you, Deran Young.

Candice Wu 5:33
All right, I'm thrilled to have you here today, Deran. I truly appreciate the way you're showing up in the world, I feel, I feel that you're so candid and vulnerable and being yourself as well as encouraging and supporting others to be on their own journey of healing of empowerment, self-awareness, and engaging others in conversations about very important topics. I am, you're an advocate of marginalized populations, you have a nonprofit called Black Therapists Rock, and you've practiced social work in five different countries, and you even were in the Air Force for 17 years.

Candice Wu 6:14
Hello, Deran!

Deran Young 6:15
It's been a busy life.

Candice Wu 6:18
It's been a busy life, right? How did you, how did you get to where you are today?

Deran Young 6:24
Well, what I know now is that I have a part that keeps me very busy. Partially, because that's the way my childhood was. And I think for a lot of black women, that's kind of the norm for our life. And that's what we know to be not just survival, but kind of our existence is that you know, we have, we're very multifaceted, you know, have a lot of labels, a lot of hats that we wear, and it becomes something that we enjoy, and also something to be very mindful and aware of. So, for me, like I said, growing up as the oldest child of a mother who had three children and was addicted to substances, and had a lot of untreated mental health issues, I was kind of the, I would say, the first in charge, I wouldn't even say the second in charge shift was like, you know, I had to, had to constantly know what was going on. Be planning ahead. Always thinking, always future-oriented and moving forward. And so it's, it's become a big part of my personality. And for a little while, I started to resent that, um, you know, because I got to a place in my early 30s, where I was exhausted. But now, I know, because I'm more aware of it, right? I can talk to that part, and really get some insight from it, and listen to its wisdom that it has for me, and not just, you know, being busy for the sake of being busy, but being focused on the things I'm called to do.

Candice Wu 7:57
Lovely. Yeah. And so when you say part, I know what you mean. You're talking about a part of you, and, but I think this is a very essential way that you're speaking, in terms of working with the parts of you, and specifically, I think you're working with internal family systems. Can you explain a bit about how you see internal family systems for anyone out there that's listening in that doesn't know about it?

Deran Young 8:30
Right. Well, excuse me, I'm kind of getting over a cold as well. I have a six-year-old… Who keeps me healthy. (laughing)

Candice Wu 8:42
I was gonna say, you mean, gives you like, the test of, of germs coming in and out. (laughing)

Deran Young 8:45
Right. My system is always, yes, test it.

Deran Young 8:53
But so, what I've learned from my own journey, and from the people that I have, you know, kind of walked alongside their journey that many of us experience different dynamics in our life, and some of them feel more close to who we truly are. And some of them feel like things that we've had to create, to just survive life. And so from my explanation of what internal family systems is, it's really just, you know, in our traumas we, we create, or we develop protectors that help us keep putting one foot in front of the other, basically. They help us manage risk in life, they tell us was safe, what's not safe, and give us kind of some intuitive knowledge about how to navigate the world.

Deran Young 9:41
And so, we learned these things, and some of us will sometimes try to unlearn them or disregard them. And as a therapist who specializes in trauma, what I noticed when I was working, particularly with the military population, is this big urge to really get rid of these thoughts or urges or features, feelings, you know, just disregard them, try to come up with a plan to overcome them, if you will, and not really listened to them or get to know them in any way. So, from the, I'll say, you know, from the cognitive behavioral therapy perspective for me, and never really worked, because I didn't understand how I kept coming back to these, these thoughts, these feelings, these emotions, or these behaviors, like I could, you know, overcome them for a temporary time. But it seemed very natural for me to find myself back to those things.

Deran Young 10:35
And so I began to get curious about, you know if I have this tendency to keep coming back to them, why is that? So, maybe I need to understand how they got here in the first place, like, what is their core being, if you will, and how did they originate? And what is it that I need to know, in order to really honor them? Right? These thoughts, these feelings, and these things that I'm telling you patterns, and I'm experiencing, and to me, that's really the definition of self-love. When people talk about, you know, all my life will say, Oh, you just need to learn how to how to love yourself. And I say, well, is there a book for that? Like? (laughing)

Candice Wu 11:21
How do you love yourself? Yeah.

Deran Young 11:23
Right, we throw that around so frequently. I find that you know, everybody was like, oh, self-love, self-love, self-love and no one can actually tell you what that looks like. And so, when I found IFS, I found a way my own unique way to really practice self-love. And it starts with self-awareness, like I said, respect for all of my experiences, and what they've taught me. And just getting to know the internal experience and the internal journey that has made up Deran Young.

Candice Wu 11:56
Beautiful. Yeah, I'm really with you on that I, I think so self-love is, it just can mean so many different things. But when you, when it comes down to knowing all the different parts of you, knowing the pieces, pieces of you that make up who you are today, or where you resist, or where there's some tension in you, or different parts speaking up, it's, at least for me, it's given me so much more ease in myself, to accept and love those parts, to know them, really. If I'm not going to use the word love. So, we defined it a little better, but like to get to know them, feel through them, and how they interact with each other. Yeah.

Deran Young 12:41
Yup. Other words that really come to mind when I think about IFS and self-love is, you know, grace. I got to a point, I want to say about four years ago, where I just realized I'm just a human, like, I don't have all the answers to life. I'm, I don't know why I'm expecting myself to have it figured out.

Candice Wu 13:00
Yeah.

Deran Young 13:00
And allow myself to have some grace in the not knowing. It's a really, just embrace that, embrace the grace, embrace self-compassion. And in the military, that wasn't, I wasn't, there was no place for that. There wasn't a place for compassion, let alone self-compassion, you know, because I had to be focused on duty. And now, I realized those two can co-exist. But I had to learn how. I had to learn how to be responsible, you know, how to still have a strong sense of duty and work ethic, and also have compassion for myself. And I think, again, you know, for a lot of black women, that's not a privilege that we've had, you know, throughout our experience is, you know, that's often seen as you're feeling bad for yourself or beating yourself. But really, there's a difference. I think when it comes to really just having grace with yourself.

Candice Wu 13:57
That's definitely different from having pity. It's

Deran Young 14:00
Yeah.

Candice Wu 14:01
Is this what you're talking about with a legacy burden? In the black community is this related?

Deran Young 14:06
Oh, yeah.

Candice Wu 14:07
Can you speak more about that?

Deran Young 14:08
Absolutely. One of the gifts of the biggest gifts, I think, that IFS has really given me is that I now have the knowledge, the legacy part that was passed down to me. And I get to decide and be aware of what I'm passing down to my son. Because like I said, you know, it's kind of unconscious, if you if you're not aware that things have passed, been passed down to you, to culture, through history, to political strife, you know, through influences of society, then you're taking it all in, and you're just discharging it to others that you love. You don't even realize it. And so yeah, I noticed that there was, I had a big legacy burden, I still kind of struggle with it around being strong.

Deran Young 14:54
And I think a lot of us have that. That, you know, I have to be strong, I can't show emotion, can't be vulnerable. You know, I can't let others know that I'm not okay, I have to be strong, I can't make a mistake, I can't admit that I've made a mistake. And I have to be loyal to a fault. I just have to be strong. And I noticed that kind of my son, he was starting, you know, at five years old, he was starting to blame himself for things I'm like, what's this about? And I realized that he's only practicing what he's learned, firsthand from me.

Deran Young 15:29
And so, we started to talk about that, you know, like, you know, taking ownership for only what's yours. And that you don't have to take on things that, that you feel you, you know, you're seeing mom take on or that, that you think mom wants you to take on, right? And that can be really active in my parenting and mindful and approach it in a way that is present and grounded. You know, even the influences of society as to gender, what boys do and what girls do. You know we really have a lot of good conversations about that. My son, and I, because I feel like it's so important, as a little black boy, that he hears my message, he has my own lessons of what it means to be, you know, in his body, and not just taking in what he's learning at school or from his peers or from TV, but really having a counter to all those messages as well.

Candice Wu 16:25
Absolutely. I love that you're having those really important conversations with him. And for you, some of what you're advocating or increasing awareness around is how marginalized populations have experienced, social or emotional challenges or the impact on their experience in the world. Is that part of what you're talking about with your son? Or how do you address that?

Deran Young 16:53
Oh, absolutely. Yeah, I'll never forget it. Like I was really anxious about him starting kindergarten last year because I remember a lot of painful experiences going into the school setting. And I hadn't remembered him, of course, until he turned five. He has a way of really reminding us of our own pain, you know, prior past experiences. And one day, in the middle of the school year, he came home and said, you know, Mom, I wish I was white like everybody else. And that was such a familiar feeling to me. And the first is my first instinct was to blame the school and to take him out of the school and to get really angry and just be filled with rage.

Candice Wu 17:35
Like Mama

Deran Young 17:36
Because I thought, how could my son… like I talked, we talked about race all the time, we're very proud of our culture and our heritage and our history. So, why, how is it that he's coming home from school at five years old, saying he thinks that what he is is wrong, he thinks that what he is inferior, someone had told him that brown wasn't the best, right? So, again, we interpret these messages of being inferior. And that has, it plays a role in my psyche, it plays a huge role in our psyche.

Deran Young 18:10
And so once that got activated in me, I went back to my five-year-old little girl who felt that same pain and was just over, you know, overcome with emotion. And because of IFS, you know, I was able to after a few weeks, it took me some time. I'll be honest, I had to really process it with some peers and get some help for this. But I was able to kind of separate and see my core self, my highest wise version of Deran, and see that little girl who was hurting at five years old, who didn't have anyone to talk to about it, who felt ashamed and felt like I needed to keep it a secret that I felt so different as a dark-skinned black girl in Texas. It's wearing all white spaces, you know that that had to be a secret or couldn't, I couldn't talk about what that experience was like.

Deran Young 18:58
And so, I saw that that was different from my son that at least, you know, he does have a safe place where he can come home and express this. And he cries about it, you know, and that, that is normal, you know, that pain that you're feeling is real. And then I could hold him and be, you know, have a really empowering space for him to process all the emotion that comes with that, right? And I guess Initially, I couldn't do that, because I was so stuck in my own pain and hurt and anger, that I just I wasn't in of any help. To him, it was like we're to five-year-old kids.

Candice Wu 19:33
Yeah. But then you did work with your five-year-old self, and then you write what you didn't get.

Deran Young 19:40
Exactly. To me, that's what it means to heal from legacy burdens, you know, to really disrupt the generational trauma line, or the cycle of fear, and overwhelm, if you will.

Candice Wu 19:54
Absolutely. I can really relate to that Deran I, I was thinking it about my five-year-old self as you were talking about that. And it's more like of my whole entire younger self, maybe, to my 20s, or something that kept that kind of inferior experience silent.

Candice Wu 20:15
Being Chinese American, and living in a white, mostly white area, but having really no outlet, or even awareness that that could be part of my experience. And then later, coming to find, wow, oh my gosh, that actually was there for that whole time. But I, absolutely like working with not just a part of me. But like an aspect of me, among many parts, or many younger parts of me. I just think it's so powerful that you're bringing that to your son. And that's an open conversation.

Deran Young 20:55
Yeah, and I just want to really, like open that conversation to the world to our society. Like, I really feel like these are the conversations that need to be had, our country is based on and built on a lot of oppression and marginalization on years, hundreds of years of, since our existence, really, of marginalized people not being heard, not being validated, not being seen. And there's been some trauma that's built up because of that. There's some pain involved in that has been hidden, and suppress.

Deran Young 21:28
And so I really feel like, you know, we're in a great time and a great, it's a great opportunity for all of us to come together and talk about, either side of things, whether you've been on the side where you know, you haven't been, you haven't been, you haven't felt that you were oppressed, but you're part of the privilege side of it. Or you're part of the people who have felt oppressed by classism, or sexism, or racism, and how things overlap, because the racism is just a wide spectrum of it, there's so many layers and intersectionalities that have to be discussed, like they have to be included in the conversation, like I said, with my son, you know, as a black boy, you know, I'm having to face the fact that black men are being gunned down in the streets. And what that, the fear that that induces in me, and to be mindful of how to protect him in a real sense, without creating kind of emotional barriers for him, right? And I still, that's something that I still don't have the answer to, but I'm able to give myself some grace and some compassion, as I, you know, really just force that journey. To know that it's going to be painful. It's a painful thing, you know, it would be abnormal if I didn't experience that kind of pain.

Candice Wu 22:46
Yeah, absolutely. And it's a completely unknown space, right?

Deran Young 22:51
Right.

Candice Wu 22:51
As everything's changing, and yet this is still this violence is still happening.

Deran Young 22:56
Exactly.

Candice Wu 22:57
At the same time. Yeah. Talking about cross-cultural communication and having these open conversations. It's so hard to see on Facebook, people trying to have these conversations, and yet they just turned into attacking.

Deran Young 23:14
Right.

Candice Wu 23:15
And I think that having a safe space is so important. What do you think's important in terms of how we begin these conversations? Or how we continue them? How do we create some space for that?

Deran Young 23:30
Yeah. Again, you know, I think that's why IFS has been so helpful to me in my role as the founder of Black Therapists Rock. And why I'm so passionate about getting more black therapists, trained in this model, is because it really lays out a format for us to create safety, to talk about things that no one else is talking about.

Deran Young 23:52
At the most recent if this conference, I had a white therapist, a middle-aged white man, come to me said that he felt that there was a block or barrier that he was having, as it relates to having this kind of conversation with people. And he really felt disconnected with me, and he wanted to be connected. You know, so just knowing that there's a desire there, I think there's a desire for all of us as a natural desire to connect to all human beings. And our hearts are what get in the way, right? Our fears, our, our difficulties with managing the emotion that comes up, is what gets in the way with us connecting. And so, you know, I was able to use the IFS model, I was able to work through the steps with him, and were able to have this really beautiful connection, that was healing for therapeutic for both myself and him.

Deran Young 24:46
You know, he'll tell me every so often just how meaningful that was for him. And I can't express enough just how meaningful it was for me as well. Like, I haven't had that kind of connection with a Caucasian, middle-aged man, you know, I don't get to have those experiences very often.

Candice Wu 25:03
Yeah.

Deran Young 25:03
And I think we gained something, you know, when we're able to come together and see each other for who we really are, as you know, mutual souls, you know, that are on a journey to learn and love one another. I think that we, we all have a lot to gain from that.

Candice Wu 25:23
Absolutely. And I think it's really interesting how you do integrate the spiritual component, like speaking of the soul, and your core being, and you have this way of weaving that all together with this reality of what's happening, and the many different parts. And how do you, how do you see the connection between spirituality and all of the intersectionality of identity and who we are?

Deran Young 25:55
Yeah.

Candice Wu 25:56
The challenge with that.

Deran Young 25:58
So, for me, you know, I really, especially, I've seen it in my son a lot, you know, when you see children who haven't really been tainted yet, and they're still innocent. Using this, this classic love of everything, this curiosity, this openness, and it's like, we evolve, you know, we evolve when we can come from a place of open-hearted curiosity and acceptance and love, we, I think that that's what spirituality is all about. It's about understanding how to love yourself and others, and how to bring more of that to the world. That's, I believe, that is the primary purpose of all of us being here. And so, when you think of a higher power or the creator of the universe, this divine, being that facilitates are, you know, that helps facilitate our growth and our journey. And us having all that we can have here, this experience of being in the potty.

Deran Young 27:03
I think it's important that, you know, children, again, they have so much to teach us from that, because they're new, they just got here. So, they don't know all the things that we know, they're not afraid, and the ways that we're afraid. And so, they're more willing to express love, in openness, and to really learn in a way that is deep, and that is fulfilling. So, to me, that's what spirituality is all about, regardless of what label you put it on. In terms of religion, you know, I do identify as a Christian, however, at that, it's just one layer. Know, like, I do believe that Christ was someone who taught us how to love, who taught us what it meant to be open, and accepting. And he is a good example. But I believe there are many other examples as well, I believe that we still have present days examples, and people that we need to learn from and be open to.

Deran Young 27:58
And so I don't, I'm not a person who just kind of narrowly focuses in on spirituality, I really believe that there's a lot to learn from most religions. I've practiced as a Muslim before, for five years, I was a Muslim. I've studied Buddhism. I'm just a very open person. And I believe that's how our spirit or soul really can evolve is when we are open when we don't have fears or barriers around what could be.

Candice Wu 28:29
That's so interesting that you studied all the different religions, and you are a Muslim for five years. And I've also just combined that with your travels. And being in different cultures, I imagine what stands out to about your learning or your growth through those experiences?

Deran Young 28:49
Yeah, I'm really open to learning from other souls, you know, I don't want to restrict my learning of self in the world, to just the, you know, 50 states in America. I want to expand to this global context, that we have of different people from different, you know, backgrounds, approaching life, all types of ways. And again, I think it's all about the evolution of you and me, you know, and, you know, really just sitting in with when I encounter someone else's soul or someone else's spirit, how does that energy that exchange of energy influence me? Or what I believe? And how does it help me believe more?

Candice Wu 29:36
Yeah, I can really relate to that I'm in Ireland at the moment. And culturally, it's very different for me. And to be more specific, and learning a way of you see, I'm quite used to connecting with people on a deeper level, with my work, and just the podcast. And you know, you and I are, you don't know each other very well here and yet, we're talking about some, some deep things to some degree. And here, I'm not having those conversations at all. And when they're brought up, it's brought up and banter. It really challenges me, but that's part of what I love as well as to learn from different energies and see what it brings up in me and where its challenges may be a dark spot in me or a spot in me that I never even considered. We're just feeling into another way. So yeah, I appreciate that.

Deran Young 30:35
Yeah, you know, the discomfort is where we learn. You know, I've made my purposely in or intentionally made myself uncomfortable at times as well. Just to see, you know, what, what else is there? You know, that,

Candice Wu 30:48
Yeah.

Deran Young 30:49
I'm a very, like I said, an ever-evolving person. And the day that I stopped learning and stop, stop evolving, then my purpose for being here is no longer there. So, I think is really important to this constantly, that curiosity about the external world also about your internal journey, your internal experiences are so important.

Candice Wu 31:13
Absolutely. So, I'm so curious, what was the Air Force like for you?

Deran Young 31:19
Really, really hard for me.

Deran Young 31:25
I mean, people, it's so interesting, because people are still like, I can't believe you were the military. And I like I can't believe I was in the military.

Candice Wu 31:36
Yeah, I was surprised to read that in your biography. And to know that about you, I just didn't. Wow. So what was hard about it?

Deran Young 31:45
It goes back to that whole simplicity and how, you know, we really are capable of so much more than we think we are. You know, even what we think we are,

Candice Wu 31:56
And you are capable of it for 17 years.

Deran Young 32:00
Yeah. What I loved about the military is that I really got to interact with people from all over the world. And that's to me as a journey that has been priceless, to just, because I'm so passionate about culture, and diversity, the military was this perfect setting, to really experience that in my work, you know, on a daily basis, because the military attracts people from all types of countries, all types of religions, all classes. And so, it really was a diverse workplace, I will say that. It also took me to countries that I may have never even experienced, and it's different to experience a place as a visitor, versus when you actually live and work there.

Deran Young 32:45
So, when I was in Italy for two years, I got to really immerse myself in the culture, and learn from it. People will say I was really morbid but I was on the tale of a divorce when I got stationed in Italy. And I landed there with a two-year-old. In the first week, I just cried my eyes out said: “Now how the hell am I going to be able to travel as a single mom with a two-year-old? Right?”

Candice Wu 33:09
Oh, yeah.

Deran Young 33:11
And I just, it just felt so impossible. But after I got to really know, the Italian culture, I realized that it's all about their culture is really about resting and about people. And so, it was a perfect place for me. It was a perfect place for my son. He got to learn Italian. He got to experience the culture, even I think in a deeper way than I did. And we were able to travel more than what we've been able to travel here.

Deran Young 33:40
We travel, I think we went to eight different countries while we were there. And not just in Europe, we got to see the Middle East. We went to Dubai, Saudi Arabia, and Oman. And then we got to see a lot of Asia as well. So, it was a real period of exploration of us an actual real rest. That I think is very different than what you find on a day to day basis here in America.

Candice Wu 34:06
Oh, yeah. Wow. That's incredible.

Deran Young 34:10
Yeah.

Candice Wu 34:11
So, what challenges you right now? What do you grappling with around IFS or race, identity, gender, ethnicity? And any topic? what's, what are you testing with?

Deran Young 34:26
Where there are sticky points? Yeah, there's a lot of sticky points. So, I think we're aware of them now, instead of trying to just, you know, shut them to the side and move on.

Candice Wu 34:36
Oh, yeah.

Deran Young 34:36
We're like, hey, let's yeah, let's pay attention to that, that that might be important.

Candice Wu 34:41
Right. I'm with you on that. It's like, Oh, that's uncomfortable but okay.

Deran Young 34:49
Yeah, I would say, number one would be my journey as a leader, you know, as a thought leader, to have my own thoughts, my own experience, my own needs, my own desires, it's also serving others. I like to call, consider myself a servant leader. And being that there are 20,000 professionals in our Facebook group for Black Therapists Rock, it can be really, really challenging to both hold space for myself, and to create, you know, maintaining safety for others, for 20,000 others.

Candice Wu 35:21
Yeah. That's huge.

Deran Young 35:23
So, that's been the biggest challenge, I'll say, and then you know, and then being responsible for a whole human being at home, as a mom, just navigating all of those, those layers of surface and self care, or service and self, you know, and in really trying to learn about that as much as I can, because it's a day to day battle or struggle, I would say, of just how much of myself do I give How much do I hold back, you know, how much do I protect.

Deran Young 35:56
And so, that's definitely an ongoing journey. And as it relates to my own goals in life, you know, as I said, I'm working on my Ph.D. now, and trying to make sure that I serve others well, and also serve myself in a way that doesn't burn me out because I'm prone to that, I'm prone to doing too much, you know, to being strong, to taking care of everyone except me. And so, I've had to really be mindful of what it is like I said that I want to what areas I want to focus in, you know, not being able to do, no one, I don't think anyone can do it all and I've stopped trying.

Deran Young 36:44
I had to stop trying, you know.

Candice Wu 36:46
That's a hard one to stop, right?

Deran Young 36:49
Yeah, sometimes I need your reminders like okay, you need to you know, ask for help when you need to slow down, pace yourself, you know, but I think the more in tune you are with that self-energy that core part of you, the easier that gets in the more, again, the more mindful you are when you're not aligned with what you're supposed, what you're called to do. You have that feeling of, no this doesn't feel quite right, like, you know, am I doing this as something to do? Why am I doing this as something I need to do for me? For my evolution, for my journey for my growth. And so, I'm just constantly more aware of that meditating on that every day. Because there's a lot that I want to do. I'm a doer.

Candice Wu 37:33
I can see. I can, ahh.

Deran Young 37:37
I get a little excited about doing you know, as an activist, as you know, as a social worker. That's just it. I think it comes a little bit with the territory we love, we love helping we love serving and then you also have to leave space for yourself.

Candice Wu 37:55
Absolutely. I know when I get into that mode, like the doing and the over functioning, trying to do it all it's definitely my self who's trying to survive and that's the way she thinks it's going to happen to get the most love and to get the most attention the way that she wants. It just doesn't work for me anymore.

Deran Young 38:18
No.

Candice Wu 38:21
Yeah.

Deran Young 38:21
You get older, you get tired here like this is not sustainable, you know.

Candice Wu 38:28
I know, right? I mean this whole lot, yah!

Candice Wu 38:33
This whole last year actually, I don't know if you know this about me, Deran, I've been traveling the last year and a half. And as I've traveled, I've been resting like crazy. And I think it's this coming down from all the doing, I'm not doing now it's just as you said, I'm carefully choosing and being intentional. Still, have to work on it here and there. When I get in a new, you know, a new thing comes along or a new environment. So, it's something to monitor and keep my eyes on but I just like rested like crazy. I just yeah. I needed it.

Deran Young 39:16
Yeah.

Candice Wu 39:17
Yeah.

Deran Young 39:17
The body keeps the score and it knows. you know, what you need and knows what you've done. But there are no secrets from your body.

Candice Wu 39:26
No secrets.

Deran Young 39:28
Yeah.

Candice Wu 39:29
Yeah. So, Deran Tell me about unicorns and your fascination.

Deran Young 39:34
Yeah. I'm surprised that you asked me, nobody ever gets to ask me about my infatuation on my passion for unicorns.

Candice Wu 39:43
Oh, I'm so honored.

Deran Young 39:45
Oh, no one ever. Like that doesn't exist. This is a real thing for most people. It's not worthy, I guess.

Candice Wu 39:51
Oh, it's incredibly worthy. I think there's something here.

Deran Young 39:57
Yeah. So, for me, it's just that, you know, I believe in magic. I believe that, you know, dreamers do thrive, that we have a special gift. I think intuition is important. And I don't think that our society or our world gives that enough validation that you know, there are these forces that exists that are, you know, beautiful, and whimsical and mysterious, but are very, very important. And so, to me, that's the unicorn side of me that that I just embrace that I'm not like everyone, you know, that I don't have to feel like I need to fit in or I don't need to feel like there's one right way to be. You know, it's me. So, unicorns stand out. As I said, they're dreamers, they defy boundaries if you will. And they're just really expansive in my opinion.

Deran Young 40:55
The way that I see it, yeah.

Candice Wu 40:57
Oh my gosh, yeah. I love that. I'm going to tune into my unicorn side.

Deran Young 41:02
My spirit.

Candice Wu 41:03
Thank you for that.

Deran Young 41:04
Is this like, Oh, yes. Where I go to channel the love and the beauty of life.

Candice Wu 41:11
Oh, that's great. That's such a great reminder.

Deran Young 41:15
Yeah. And maybe it's my painful part, like the childlike part of me that still wants to, you know, believe in rainbows and…

Candice Wu 41:24
Yes, yeah. I think that part of us is so important is I mean, that's where things possibility can happen. And new creativity and believing in something that you can't see.

Deran Young 41:39
Right? Absolutely. Faith is so important. So so important.

Candice Wu 41:43
It is, it is. Well, shall we do a little lightning round a quick one?

Deran Young 41:49
Sure. Let's do it.

Candice Wu 41:51
Okay. All right. All right. Um, I like asking this question. What's a recent dream you've had, like a night dream. If you remember your dreams?

Deran Young 42:04
I don't, these days, I don't because the PC is like, all I could think of and until I hit my head on the pillow, and then it's like, don't think about anything. Oh.

Candice Wu 42:15
You just have to shut down.

Deran Young 42:16
Yeah.

Candice Wu 42:18
I miss dreaming. I'm asleep right now.

Candice Wu 42:23
Yeah. Well, I hope you get back to dreaming at some point and sleep as well. Well, what parts are you working with right now?

Deran Young 42:35
I kind of want to go back to the last question, I know it's a lightning round. But I'm,

Candice Wu 42:39
Oh, sure, yeah.

Deran Young 42:40
I think I dream out loud now like, I dream when awake.

Candice Wu 42:44
Oh!

Deran Young 42:44
I really feel like I'm living my dreams like, that, I'd say that that's another gift of that, I'm more present. With that. Like I said that. Inside that unicorn side now walks along with me, instead of being buried and hidden is something that I'm very open to and aligned with and that I experienced on a day to day basis. So, I will say that I really do feel like I'm living my dreams. Like, I don't know what the best dream could be. Because I feel like every day is it. If that makes sense. I don't know if that sounds too cliche. But,

Candice Wu 43:18
Oh, yeah.

Deran Young 43:19
I mean, I'm doing work that I absolutely love. I get to spend so much time with my son that most parents, single parents don't get to spend. You know, I feel like I have a lot of privileges in my life, that really do feel like a dream for a little black girl who grew up in Texas, with a mother who was on drugs and had mental health issues like that all just feels, this feels like a dream.

Candice Wu 43:41
You've really created your life.

Deran Young 43:43
Yeah. Yeah.

Candice Wu 43:44
It's just yeah, powerful. Thank you. So, my next question is, what parts are you working with right now?

Deran Young 43:53
I'm working with pirates. Oh, that's funny to ask. This is one that I am really, it's hard for me to be friends. But I have a part that bashes men.

Deran Young 44:05
That's, that's pretty pissed off at times when it comes to patriarchy and misogyny and he and she's not unburdened yet. Like she's very angry about the pain and suffering of women that has been very pervasive in, in all of society. No, no matter where you go, I was in China, actually, about four or five months ago, doing a seven-day IFS workshop, and just the legacy burdens of what it meant to be a woman. And it was exactly around the same time as the Kavanaugh situation where, you know, foolishness is all. That for that part you like, we just have no, very no-nonsense when it comes to this overpowering of women. And this intrusiveness of women's bodies and our needs and our need to be, to be human and to be valued. It's just, that she's very intolerant of that.

Deran Young 45:10
And so, I've been really trying to work with that part to see that they also are impacted by that, that men also are harmed by patriarchy and misogyny and it's not just women who are suffering, that there is suffering on both sides.

Candice Wu 45:24
I can hear a different…

Deran Young 45:25
Yeah.

Candice Wu 45:26
Yeah, I can hear a different part of you coming online when you say that.

Deran Young 45:31
Yeah, I'm able to tap into self-energy at times, you know, and implant but if I like, part of her doesn't want to implant she's like, no! we want to be mad, we want to be pissed off.

Candice Wu 45:42
Yeah.

Deran Young 45:42
I submit.

Candice Wu 45:46
And validly so!

Deran Young 45:48
Right, but I have to add, and I'm grateful to the man.

Candice Wu 45:52
Thank you for sharing.

Deran Young 45:52
Yes, a really vulnerable part for me. Because I was also sexually abused, I was sexually abused by a woman as a child, but I believe she was sexually abused by a man. And so, I am so grateful to the men in my life, who helped remind me, you know, of the balance of things, and that, you know, it's easy to get one-sided. It is so easy to get trapped in your pain and only see that perspective. And not to see how everyone is connected and how, you know, compassionate love is really the only, the only answer to it.

Candice Wu 46:28
Yeah, you know, I feel like when we get there, it's sort of like that part of us is digging in their heels and saying, No, I need to see this big time. But, but yeah, I completely understand, finding that other side, and right, get in there at some point. If not now. Yeah. And I think that part is alive and so many people right now, men and women and other, you know, right? In a lot of people.

Candice Wu 47:05
How are you affected by the moon?

Deran Young 47:07
The moon, that's a new phenomenon for me. People think that I've been meditating, spiritual guru for a long time, I'm like, No, this is like real new to me, probably within the last year that I've started to really understand and learn about. I've been taught, I would say, Daphne Fuller, hopefully, she gets to hear this at some point. She is the founder of Black Minds and Meditation. And she's also a member of Black Therapists Rock. But she has this movement, where she's really trying to get more people of color to specifically black people, to engage with things like yoga, in energy healing, and she is the one who introduced me to meditation and, you know, understanding the universe. And, you know, knowing that we are connected to the universe, that's been a foreign concept in my life, up until the last year. And so now I'm very, very, very aware of the moon cycles. And I think it's interesting, because as a Muslim, you know, the holidays and the schedule, the calendar is all based around the sun in the moon. Yeah, I didn't, I didn't connect that to my emotional experience, you know, that the reasons why things exist the way they do. But I'm grateful now for that new learning that, you know, it's important to know what's going on in the universe and in our planet? And how that impacts me as a part of that.

Candice Wu 48:38
Absolutely. Wow. You know, that's surprising for me to hear that this is only been the last year that you've been in this, I guess language that maybe your belief set because you're just in it, you're in it now.

Deran Young 48:52
And I think that was why it was important for me to create Black Therapists Rock, because a lot of things we just haven't had access to, you know, now realizing just how huge the disparity is.

Candice Wu 49:03
Yeah.

Deran Young 49:04
What were, you know, what resources we have, what language we have, what theories were presented with, like most like there, because had not heard of IFS before I started to be an advocate for it.

Candice Wu 49:17
And when did you start doing that?

Deran Young 49:19
This was about, I would say, two years now.

Candice Wu 49:22
Wow.

Deran Young 49:23
Yeah, I, you know, had my own healing experience with IFS, and I was just so passionate about it because I had never been seen in this way. As for all the different layers that I bring to the table, right, as a black woman, parent, veteran, you know, all of those different things, to be able to look at all of those a whole space for them all.

Deran Young 49:46
In the totality of who I am, that I'm not one label, as we are often, you know, we're often placed in one box, you're an angry black woman. Yeah, single parent only are you here, you know, you can't be you can only be one thing and a lot of the theories of psychology and sociology. And so, I just when I discovered IFS, I was just like, well, there's a whole nother world that was open to me. And I see that a lot. And looks like their pieces that we've only been given access to the things that were kind of close, closely available to us. If it's, you know, over a certain dollar amount. If it requires travel, then there's a barrier.

Candice Wu 50:25
Wow.

Deran Young 50:27
Yeah.

Candice Wu 50:28
And I think that, what you're saying to, about how impactful IFS has been for you, it gives such space for that complexity, and it, it releases the pressure around, you know, if you have to claim your anger, but then you feel like you're going to be pinned as the angry black woman, then why would you claim that anger? You know, like, it could be dangerous. It could feel scary.

Deran Young 50:58
Yeah. And the other thing is that I realized I said, everybody, you know, there's this common notion of angry black woman, but no one's ever stopped and asked them what they're angry about.

Candice Wu 51:07
Yeah.

Deran Young 51:08
Like, how many times do you ever woman down and say, Well, tell me why you're angry. And thankfully, I had IFS therapist who was able to do that for me, you know, and the first time she asked me, it was it threw me off. I'm like, what she really validated my anger actually shouldn't ask me what I was angry about is that you have a lot to be angry about. And even more importantly, you have a lot to be said about a lot to grieve. And that was like this opening a whole another layer of emotions that I had not been available to me before. I wasn't allowed to go there, you weren't allowed to be to say that you're, to agree with being at the angry black woman and what might be underneath that. It just was a no go. You know, it was a very,

Candice Wu 51:49
Yeah, like, you're blamed for it, but you're not really allowed to go there.

Deran Young 51:53
No.

Candice Wu 51:55
Yeah, that's really interesting. I'm just thinking about my own relationship to anger, how was it evolved, and I was never pinned as the angry Asian women, you know, and, yet, there was this experience of you can't be angry. And I was full of rage. And had to work with a lot of that.

Deran Young 52:18
That's another legacy burden of patriarchy is that men are only angry, they're not allowed to be sad, you know, they could only be angry. And women are only allowed to be nice.

Candice Wu 52:28
Right?

Deran Young 52:29
Right.

Candice Wu 52:30
Right, all of these things that are placed on us.

Deran Young 52:33
Yeah.

Candice Wu 52:35
And that we place on each other.

Deran Young 52:37
That limits us it really, truly, it just limits our experience. It blocks, you know, our ability to connect and to have compassion for one another.

Candice Wu 52:45
Yeah. Because we're so much more than just that one thing that can be noticed in us and we are just complex with all these different parts.

Deran Young 52:56
Right.

Candice Wu 52:58
Well, thank you, Deran, this was love. I really enjoyed hearing from you. And I feel very inspired as well. Is there anything else you want to share today?

Deran Young 53:10
No, just that I think I want to leave everyone on the idea of, you know, in these times where there's so much polarization and so much disagreement, politically, socially, on a lot of different constructs, I think it's really important to tap into, when you disagree, what's coming up, you know, when it when we have that urge to say, I don't think you're right, you have to be absolutely wrong. There's no way you could be right. And what does that mean if they are? What's the fear behind that? You know, I had an interaction with someone today that just said, you know, there should be a White Therapists Rock.

Deran Young 53:51
And, you know, I had to sit with myself and say, Okay, what is it, that startup from me? You know, I can attack him, I can, you know, do all those things. Those are, those are really easy things to do. But the harder part is to have a conversation that involves me being vulnerable, right? That then involves me, truly sharing what I'm really feeling the saddest that I feel when people say things like that. And how do we have these conversations together and community so that we don't reject one another, or, you know, go back into our corners, and you just create more hate, whether it's with men and women, whether it's with people or different cultures, different religions, different sexual orientations, different abilities. I just think there's so much for us to learn from each other when we peel back the surface layers of the labels.

Candice Wu 54:42
Yeah. And what I'm really getting from what you're saying is, notice those moments where something gets you where something, something in you reacts and go a little deeper with it, and then feel into your heart and open up a bit.

Deran Young 54:58
Exactly.

Candice Wu 54:58
Thank you for that. Wonderful. Well, it's been fabulous to have you thank you so much. Deran where can people find you?

Deran Young 55:07
Yes, I'm very, very, very active on Facebook in case you didn't know.

Candice Wu 55:11
Well, really?

Deran Young 55:15
We can find me all over Facebook, I have a personal page that some people enjoy following. I also have a business page where I'm trying to be more active in regards to activism, and racial trauma, just exploring the complexities of racial trauma. And then we have Black Therapists Rock has a public page as well. And of course, we have a website, we can learn more about our events and our activities that we have coming up with throughout 2019. We have a Facebook sponsored project, where we're going to be doing more communal healing activities, we want to do a cruise in the fall. So be on the lookout for that, that discusses legacy burdens. And so we want to bring people from various bits backgrounds together, again, to have these conversations in a very healthy and safe way that furthers us in love.

Deran Young 56:07
We're going to be having some workshops, where people can get see us and understand the ethical aspect, you know, as helpers, that we have a commitment to want to connect with other individuals in a deeper way if we want to help them in their mental health journey. And so those are some of the things that we have coming up, you can find more out about that at the website, www.blacktherapistsrock.com. And I look forward to meeting folks in person or online.

Candice Wu 56:38
That's awesome Deran I just want to ask, too, who are invited in the Black Therapists Rock community?

Deran Young 56:46
Well, so we kind of have layers of involvement. So, our Facebook group is really a place for us to kind of connect and explore what it means to be a black therapist with each other amongst our peers. And so that's what that's really been secret for. So, the Facebook group is for black therapists. The events, the Facebook, the public page, all the other spaces are inclusive, and we warmly welcome folks to follow us and get involved in the conversations and to actually come out and engage with us in person. Because this is not you know, black mental health is not a topic that should only be involved with black people. I really think is an issue or a challenge that needs to everyone involved.

Candice Wu 57:36
Absolutely. Thank you. Um, there's just one more thing I wanted to mention to Deran. Have you heard of family constellations?

Deran Young 57:45
I keep hearing about it.

Candice Wu 57:47
Yeah.

Deran Young 57:48
Yeah, you're probably like the six or seven, the person that has mentioned this, I probably should do some research on it.

Candice Wu 57:54
Oh, well, we can talk about it more. And yeah, yeah, um, it's something I practice, and it's working with the ancestry. We don't use words, legacy burdens, but with what you're saying it's so similar. It's like looking at not from an analytical or mentally analyzing perspective. But opening up space where we embody what is happening in the ancestry without knowing the end even mentally. So, we just step into those spaces of a mother, father, and farther back, grandparents or whoever, and we start to see what's the dynamic that's going on or were tied to, bonds of pain, or stories untold and unseen, in our ancestry, women were carrying them through in our life. And so I just wanted to bring that up and connect that with what you're sharing around a legacy burden. And maybe that's a whole other conversation for us. But yeah, it's such good work.

Deran Young 59:07
Well, I want to just say, you know, that I think that what's been helpful to me, or let me just go to one of the biggest challenges that I experienced as a black person, that I think is a unique legacy burden for us is that so much of our legacy has been cut off. You know, I know that other cultures experienced that, but to, you know, to be able to go back in your heritage and not know where someone was sold, or, you know, it gets very, very complicated. So, I've had to really depend on spiritual guides, like when I go to Africa, I really get in touch with how my spirit feels there. And what really, you know, kind of enriches my spirit, when I'm in the land to where I believe my ancestors came from. But if anyone, I want to put this challenge out to your viewer, that maybe my followers, if anyone has ties to folks in the family constellations work, I would love to really just maybe create a relationship with them and learn more of how more Black Therapist can be utilizing that work to help us with this legacy burden of slavery. And you know, this disconnect between Africa and an African Americans.

Candice Wu 1:00:19
Absolutely, I know of some folks that are specifically working with that, I might have to do a little research for you. But I would also be open to talking with you more about it in terms of just overall cross-cultural work and what you're saying about that disconnection, to your ancestry? That's huge. Yes, it's huge. Because when you can find that reconnection, whether that's in real life, or through the constellations work, IFS is like the internal family system work. Family constellations is seeing externally seeing what's internal, externally, through strangers. And so you can work with where the cut off was, and who was back there. And you may not know who was back there just yet. But as the picture unfolds of who's in this system, who's in this ancestry and lineage, that reconnection can happen, and it's incredibly powerful.

Deran Young 1:01:33
Oh, I'm intrigued for sure.

Candice Wu 1:01:36
Yeah.

Deran Young 1:01:37
A little scary, because I'm like my ancestors, were dealing with some major steps. I don't.

Candice Wu 1:01:43
Oh, yeah.

Deran Young 1:01:43
It proposes a little anxiety for me.

Candice Wu 1:01:44
Yeah.

Deran Young 1:01:45
What I'm very intrigued to definitely learn more, I definitely need to, to look into it. And like I said, get connected into that populates that community of folks that are doing that work.

Candice Wu 1:01:56
Yeah, yeah. And, and the really cool thing, too, is that, as I said, you don't have to know any mental information, especially if you're in discovery mode of it, you want to know, I think it can open up intuitively.

Candice Wu 1:02:10
Sometimes the participants that are representing different parts of your ancestry will just come up with something, or they'll have an intuition or a hit on something, or they'll start speaking in a way that is of the energy of what, who's back there. And it's, it just comes through them like channeling through them. And even I've worked with people who've been adopted, and so have had a different kind of disconnection. But that reconnection can bring so much love and strength, and then it starts to open up in their real life, that they come to find out more, or they start to reconnect in ways that are so unexpected.

Deran Young 1:02:53
Yeah.

Candice Wu 1:02:54
Yeah. So thanks for letting me share that with you. I think it's just wonderful to talk about this too, with your work and IFS and with culture and legacy.

Deran Young 1:03:07
Yeah.

Candice Wu 1:03:09
Well, thank you so much. And I appreciate you very much. Thank you.

Deran Young 1:03:14
Yeah, thank you.

Candice Wu 1:03:19
Wonderful to have Deran on a show. And I just loved hearing about her perspective of internal family systems and how she uses it, to heal racial trauma for herself with her clients in workshops, and how she's really brought that to a whole community of people that didn't before know about the work, I hope that you got just as much out of it and that inspires you to look at your different parts or to work with any pains and wounds that you've had in terms of societal trauma, racial trauma, ethnic trauma, gender, any identity, any parts of you that have felt wounded, it is a lovely platform to use to access those parts of you for healing, and to give safety in that, in that process, so that you can get to the core of what has hurt you and what energy is there for you to reclaim.

Candice Wu 1:04:19
So, if you want to learn more about Deran and her work, check out her website, check out Black Therapists Rock. And also, if you want to learn more about IFS, or voice dialogue, you can search IFS, or check out in the show notes that are linked to this will put some good links there to learn more information about both of those.

Candice Wu 1:04:41
Well, that's all we have for you today. I thank you so much for joining us again. And I'm always thankful to hear your thoughts, reactions, questions, and what comes of this conversation for you. So, feel free to always reach out to me. Or if you want to stay connected in another way, feel free to join my newsletter that comes out every other week. You can join at CandiceWu.com/embody. And that is a place where you can connect with me and learn more about what I'm up to, as well as receive self-love notes, events, the podcasts and other exciting things that are going on. As I mentioned earlier, be sure to check out the dream class that was just created and there are going to be a couple more that are coming out that will delve into embodying your dreams. But first, preparing your body for better remembering your dreams, and that's at CandiceWu.com/dreamphysiology. Thanks again for joining me today and see you next time on the Embody Podcast.